The Marvel Movie Debate

Over the past year there's been a lot of noise in social media on the Marvel Movies. Marvel fans took victory laps when Avengers: Endgame shattered Box Office records. Some film critics were highly cynical at the mania surrounding these films, especially the backlash of writing a negative review. Other voices from the film making community have also come out and have taken a beating on social media for it.

So, what of it? Bill Maher made waves earlier this year when he decided to dismiss all comic book fans as spoiled children unable to deal with complexity. The reaction to Maher was justified, comics have played a positive role in countless lives. Maher's clumsy attempt to slam dunk on toxic fandom, which is a real thing, added little to the discussion. Comedian Marc Maron also lashed out against the Marvel movies on the Conan O'Brien show, completely echoing what Simon stated 37 years ago. Martin Scorsese dismissed comic book movies as amusement parks, which sparked a predictable flurry of twitter outrage. 

When Return of the Jedi was released in 1983, the final film in the original Star Wars trilogy, it was considered a watershed moment in 1980s pop culture. The two most famous critics of the era Roger Ebert and Gene Siskel championed the Star Wars movies and praised the films for taking cinematic storytelling to the next level. Yet not all critics were thrilled. Pauline Kael was generally cool towards the trilogy. Speculative fiction writer and media personality Harlan Ellison despised Star Wars as a mockery of Science Fiction. Perhaps the most vociferous review came from John Simon who dismissed Star Wars as a film of "overwhelming banality." On a Nightline episode Simon squared off against Siskel And Ebert. 


Simon was a cultural conservative who wrote for publications for National Review and New York Magazine. His film criticism was notorious for making light of actors' physical appearance. His brooding European perspective poured cold water on the enthusiasm of his peers for the wave of New Hollywood films during the 1970s.

Host Ted Koppel gave Simon the first word. He condemned Jedi as a "dehumanizing film" made for children or adults with a "child mentality," sarcastically adding many of his fellow critics lacked an "adult mentality." His argument was Star Wars made "children dumber than they needed to be" and that art should engage children on the level of reality, mentioning The Adventures of Huckleberry Finn as an example.

Ebert responded by recalling the Disney films that inspired his imagination as a child, and that Star Wars was doing the same thing for the new generation. Siskel spoke of attending a screening of Jedi packed with kids having the time of their lives. Both viewed them as great works of art for children. But what about for adults?

Simon noted special effects should not be the tail that wags the dog. Ebert cleverly responded by arguing all movies are a special effect, since the film goes through the camera and is projected onto the screen by light, it's the closest experience we have to a waking dream. When asked if Jedi should be considered great art, Siskel said a film should be judged by its aspirations - and in that sense Jedi was a great film. He compared it unfavorably to the forgettable 3D movie Space Hunter also out at the time. Simon suggested taking children to see Tender Mercies, a more adult oriented film that will give audiences more to think about.

Watching the Nightline discussion now, both sides score some excellent points that take on a new meaning these days. Siskel and Ebert were correct in that Star Wars lit up the imagination of a generation. Yet Simon had a point that kids should be exposed to more complex stories.  Perhaps the long view has proved him right. 

Think of the fallout from the prequel Star Wars films, the sight of endless ranks of young men who grew up with Lucas now going on extended rants how he stole their childhood. Toxic fan behavior has metastasized into online harassment on social media and other childish behavior (a remake of The Last Jedi). Petitions to rewrite shows longtime fans find offensive are a daily occurrence. Part of this stems from a pop culture no longer serving up the fantasies of young white men, but also from a preference for the spectacle above art.

What we see are the child like mentalities Simon spoke of in 1983. I'm fine with Marvel Movies: they're well made, have created endearing characters, and are impressive feats of modern storytelling. But they never challenge an audience - and are almost chilling in their endorsement of the status quo. Do audiences want to be challenged by movies? Do we want movies that tell us something about our own reality. Going by the box office, the answer seems to be in the negative. So it's no wonder elder statesman of New Hollywood are lamenting they can no longer make the movies they want to make.